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#16 PerfectChaos

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Posted 06 May 2008 - 07:12 AM

But even if they tried to monitor us, p2p would be rather hard to monitor, wouldn't it?
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#17 JcX

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Posted 07 May 2008 - 01:15 PM

QUOTE
How very silly. Peer-to-peer file sharing itself violates no laws and no regulations. It's simply a protocol through which people can convey information in a somewhat efficient manner. It's ridiculous to say file sharing violates any rights, because it does not (it's the people who make the violations).
This is a terribly important distinction to make.

but the problem is we use p2p technology to share illegal files.
For instance, why p0rn sites are illegal? It's also sharing stuffs with peoples. Just the stuffs shared couldn't be accepted, it's just that simple.

QUOTE
But even if they tried to monitor us, p2p would be rather hard to monitor, wouldn't it?


For sure it would be hard one to track all these.
Government would just simply record down all your download quota per month and see. If you just used 100MB bandwidth per month, what could you do?? NOTHING. But if you get exceeded 50GB per month, everybody knows that you keep on downloading something huge size, so they will start monitor what you've downloaded daily and cached every file.

*I downloaded 20+GB per month... XD
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#18 PensiveSage

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Posted 09 May 2008 - 04:29 PM

I don't know all the technical standards of ISP servers and routers, but I think that they do store some of the transfer information (i.e. routes and requests of packets), and thus the government could seize these records, as they do with cell phone calls in certain investigative cases.

It is my personal opinion that without having the freedom to browse without "Big Brother" watching over our shoulder, the very principles of freedom of speech and expression are brought into question.

Technology has always faced the issues of open expression. When radio and television first came out, they stood as open medium for free expression. Though they were a bit more pricey to broadcast on, they were originally free of the commercialization and severe regulation that is held today. Though some of this is good, it generally is rather difficult for someone to "freely and openly" express themselves on either of these two standards.

At present, the internet provides a relatively easily accessible standard of expression. But it could easily become another case of radio or television if the government doesn't work to keep it open rather than restrict it

#19 awesomegamer

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Posted 12 May 2008 - 04:38 AM

QUOTE(JcX @ May 7 2008, 08:15 AM) View Post
QUOTE
How very silly. Peer-to-peer file sharing itself violates no laws and no regulations. It's simply a protocol through which people can convey information in a somewhat efficient manner. It's ridiculous to say file sharing violates any rights, because it does not (it's the people who make the violations).
This is a terribly important distinction to make.

but the problem is we use p2p technology to share illegal files.
For instance, why p0rn sites are illegal? It's also sharing stuffs with peoples. Just the stuffs shared couldn't be accepted, it's just that simple.

QUOTE
But even if they tried to monitor us, p2p would be rather hard to monitor, wouldn't it?


For sure it would be hard one to track all these.
Government would just simply record down all your download quota per month and see. If you just used 100MB bandwidth per month, what could you do?? NOTHING. But if you get exceeded 50GB per month, everybody knows that you keep on downloading something huge size, so they will start monitor what you've downloaded daily and cached every file.

*I downloaded 20+GB per month... XD


Similar to the way the government catches growers by watching electrical usage, right?
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#20 JcX

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Posted 12 May 2008 - 06:00 AM

Yea... if governmenet would like to take actions on us, there's always a way.
Just that they won't take actions on all of us.
By punishing bunches of us, it will give a good warning to all of us.
(Hope that I won't be one of them :-p)
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#21 Sungazer

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Posted 22 May 2008 - 03:52 AM

torrentz for the win =]
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#22 MYSTi

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Posted 25 May 2008 - 07:31 AM

There is no need of government to look into these matter!!!

#23 jjpriest25

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Posted 26 May 2008 - 12:09 AM

I can think of many reason's the government might want to watch the p2p networks. Pirating copyrighted material is one, so is child porn and other things like that. But to watch it for a terrorist attack? That's a bunch of crap...although I guess I wouldn't put it past them to actually be monitoring it for that reason.
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#24 JcX

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Posted 27 May 2008 - 01:11 PM

Well..... child porn I guess no one could stop that others than parents themselves.
I'm still a teenager, and many of my friends starting to experience porn since quite long time ago.
The place they watching porn is at home, while the time is when parents are out to work.
Well.... I'm not saying that isn't good, there's some advantages though allowing child to watch porn, promised that with suitable control and guidance from parents and filter the unsuitable content.
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#25 phoexer

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Posted 29 May 2008 - 02:58 PM

QUOTE(JcX @ May 27 2008, 03:11 PM) View Post
Well..... child porn I guess no one could stop that others than parents themselves.
I'm still a teenager, and many of my friends starting to experience porn since quite long time ago.
The place they watching porn is at home, while the time is when parents are out to work.
Well.... I'm not saying that isn't good, there's some advantages though allowing child to watch porn, promised that with suitable control and guidance from parents and filter the unsuitable content.


Advantages? Like what?

I think that this is a touchy subject and your views vary depending on where you are. For instance, US ppl are invariably outraged! its a violation of your rights, free speach, free drinks and all that jazz. I envie you, you get told thats happening, like someone actually has the gull to expose it and the gvt can NOT take action on them.

However for some of us with out the luxury of freedom, hearing something like that just means that you keep your opinion to yourself and change the protocols.

Gvts shouldn't monitor us, but they do.
They shouldn't attack their own citizens, but they do.
They shouldn't maim, blind or kill us, (yes you guessed it!) But they do.

They question isn't whether they should monitor p2p sharing, they already do that. Its wrong, they know that and made a conscience choice to do it anyway!
The question is what should WE do about it?

If you're in the US write an email to congress, its your right.
If you are else where, keep it to yourself. They first to write usually gets his hands chopped off.(Trust me, There's no LOL on this topic!)
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#26 Doctor Steel

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Posted 03 June 2008 - 06:30 PM

Wow, I hadn't thought of that... as bad as it is in the States, I can't believe how bad it must be in other countries (Like Zimbabwe, appearantly).

In reply to JcX: Indeed, this is what they are watching for (porn and piracy), but they have to call it "searching for terrorists" so they can use the Patriot Act to hide it from everybody but themselves. If they were really watching for what they said they were, don't you think that piracy and child porn on the internet would be nearly extinct? As it is, we're three steps away from having our own "Great Firewall of China."

I can prove we're being spied on. If you're in the United States (or maybe even Canada), open up a console window and type "tracert helionet.org" (tracert on windows, idk on linux/mac) and hit enter. You'll see a few hops through your ISP, then boom - it hits a sprintlink.net server. Lo and behold, this is where Sprint (and AT&T, if you're on their network) records ALL the internet traffic within/outbound from the US, and most inbound traffic from around the world. Try to tracert nsa.gov - you've just been tracked by Sprint AND AT&T. They probably logged your IP too, just in case you ever try to DDOS their server. We may not have a 'Great Firewall' yet, but we sure have cameras on us all the time.
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#27 phoexer

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Posted 03 June 2008 - 07:11 PM

QUOTE
Wow, I hadn't thought of that... as bad as it is in the States, I can't believe how bad it must be in other countries (Like Zimbabwe, appearantly).


Dont mind me, its a real touchy issue at the moment.

The gvt introduced a law (electronic interception act) or something like that, which states that it has the right to monitor any and all forms of electronic communication where there is "reasonable suspision" that illegal activities are occuring. So forget torrrents these guys are listening to cellphone calls and emails.

Here's the kicker, the burden is on service providers to provide the means for them to listen.
So your isp not only gives you internet, it gives them everything you do as well.

Here's the best part, in the US you can not legally listen in or monitor anyone with out a warrent right? and you can only get one of those from a judge. Here its legal if either the chief of police, director of intelligence or someone that high up says go. Translation, they can now do it and there is nothing you can do(LEGALLY).

So what do i do?
For normal communication nothing, let them look.
for stuff i dont want them to see, i'm a programmer, encryption comes easy.
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